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I'm getting tired of this: nerf ECM bursts fotm

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Morel Nova Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.04.12 08:56:00 - [1] This new trend of fitting ECM bursts to angel ships is seriously getting out of hand. These modules makes you practically immune to small ships, and have a very high chance of shaking cruiser sized vessels. Yesterday I lost tackle on 2 (two!!) cynabals in my dramiel I would have had no issue killing otherwise. it just doesnt have a viable counter due to their range matching scrambler/orbit range. I suggest reducing strength on ECM bursts with maybe 25% at least and shortening range so a smart pilot has a chance to dodge (like you can against small neuts). I admit I have been flying these myself and gotten out of insane situations with it (scrambled by 3 ceptors burst goodbye) but these ships are already hard to catch (not like the WCS dramiels though wtf) but its getting out of hand now with so many showing up. Reward small gang/solo pvp!
Morel Nova Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.04.12 09:09:00 - [2] Originally by: Marlona Sky What is so special about fitting them to Angel ships? they already have speed to escape everything other than ceptors/dramiels and plenty of midslots. vagabond for example cant do this because of midslot count. Reward small gang/solo pvp!
Morel Nova Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.04.12 09:31:00 - [3] Originally by: Marko Riva are you seriously whining about a module that uses a midslot and can be used once every 30 seconds which might/will make it possible to escape from your FOTM Dramiel? Here's a tip, use a web on the target and before they can warp away (as they have to get up to warp speed again) retarget them and tackle again. Otherwise bring friends or fit ECCM. ECCM on my ceptor? seriously? still this only pulls jam chance down to like 70-80% Reward small gang/solo pvp!
Morel Nova Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.04.12 09:43:00 - [4] Originally by: Marko Riva Originally by: Morel Nova Originally by: Marko Riva are you seriously whining about a module that uses a midslot and can be used once every 30 seconds which might/will make it possible to escape from your FOTM Dramiel? Here's a tip, use a web on the target and before they can warp away (as they have to get up to warp speed again) retarget them and tackle again. Otherwise bring friends or fit ECCM. ECCM on my ceptor? seriously? still this only pulls jam chance down to like 70-80% You whine about Cyna's using a burst "because they have the midslot", you have enormous speed and can easily devote a low slot to ECCM using that same "they have the free slots for it". Instead you whine about someone getting away from your FOTM ship, or rather have a CHANCE to get away once every 30 seconds. If you don't want it to happen bring a rapier friend, fit that eccm or bring more than one tackler. Your posting is awful. Keep it civilized, I'm just trying to make an important point here. A lowslot ECCM is even weaker, and even less viable on a solo fit like my dramiel. Reward small gang/solo pvp!
Morel Nova Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.04.12 10:31:00 - [5] Edited by: Morel Nova on 12/04/2010 10:31:24 Originally by: Marko Riva Edited by: Marko Riva on 12/04/2010 09:53:30 Also: ONE OF YOUR CYNABAL LOSSES WHERE YOU FIT ECM BURST. Get out! yes i died once inside a drag bubble, because I was dualboxing and trying to save my alt at the same time. not sure what you are trying to prove, I admit I fly them myself. I mean why limit yourself when they are so powerful? also its the only way to show CCP that it needs to be looked at for balancing purposes. Reward small gang/solo pvp!
Morel Nova Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.04.12 11:04:00 - [6] Originally by: Robert Caldera Edited by: Robert Caldera on 12/04/2010 10:58:45 Originally by: Morel Nova Powerful E-War should be reserved for dedicated ships, and the Burst should only really be viable on the scorpion, not on a 4km/s cruiser. you rant about non-dedicated ECM ships fitting ECM burst while flying a frigate faster than every interceptor(dedicated ships) ingame?? The dramiel requires a nerf, not ECM burst. the dramiel isnt the issue here. I'm talking about cynabals. ECM bursts are even more efficent against ceptors. although I have seen burst dramiels about also, they are pretty nasty, but the lower cap on them makes using the module a lot less efficient. my taranis or stiletto would have the same problem. Reward small gang/solo pvp!
Morel Nova Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.04.12 12:15:00 - [7] Originally by: Robert Caldera Edited by: Robert Caldera on 12/04/2010 11:21:40 the "issue" is you're ranting about legitimate tactics for denying you sure kills with your op dramiel. I dont see something wrong with that, if you can fit a warp scrambler on every non-dedicated ship (anything but interceptor) there is no reason why one should not be able to fit counters for that. Since speed is not working for getting out of your scramble range, ECM burst is a better choice. Accept that. I regret mentioning dramiels at all, stop trying to derail our balance discussion that is limited to cynabals & the ecm burst module. as I said all frigs face the same problem and there are a lot of other dramiel/frig threads to moan in Reward small gang/solo pvp!
Morel Nova Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.04.12 20:47:00 - [8] Originally by: Ephemeron I don't think the OP has good argument. In fact it looks like a troll However, before the Great Nano Nerf when we had 90% webs, when a webbed target broke tackle with ECM burst, there was still a chance for frigate to relock and scramble it before it reached 80% velocity to enter warp. they would have to be very on the ball. the cynabal has very high agility, much higher than the vagas of olden days. so far its worked fine. and no its not a troll, havent you guys run into this stuff? its everywhere in 0.0 now Reward small gang/solo pvp!
Morel Nova Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.04.13 07:16:00 - [9] Edited by: Morel Nova on 13/04/2010 07:25:09 Originally by: Darthewok 5 low slots + 5 mid slots + 437 CPU/1375 PG ON TOP of vaga-speed, big drone bay and super bonuses! means a complete field day to fit every kind of broken whacked-out fit you can imagine. even if this ECM burst fit is not OP, with that kind of huge fitting room, another OP Cynabal fit will easily come along to take its place. count on it. extreme favoritism has been shown to Angel ships in the pirate ship buff. in giving them far less fitting limits and better specs than other ships. time for them to be brought back in line. not necessarily true for the crusier line (I admit only 70% of the faction frigs are valid). When there is a serpentis epic arc we are going to have massive rage over 1000 dps faction 90% web vigilants killing everything (these will chew up cynabals for breakfast). I totally agree with the "nanoes is fun and we really miss it". ccp needs to bring back some of this. its slightly annoying to just see cynabals everywhere, but its because they are so fun to fly. Other races should have viable alternatives, but there are none and its reasonably fast to train.. so. Reward small gang/solo pvp!
Morel Nova Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.04.13 09:17:00 - [10] Originally by: steave435 Max skill ecm burst: 9k optimal, 6k falloff. Optimal+2x falloff=21k Warp disruptor II: 24k optimal think about it. explain to me how anything disrupting me at that range isnt dead or left behind as I burn away in my AC falloff boosted ship Reward small gang/solo pvp!
Morel Nova Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.04.13 12:45:00 - [11] Originally by: steave435 Originally by: Cpt Branko Originally by: steave435 [Sentinel, New Setup 1] How do you expect to survive in that thing? ;) By not getting hit. You even have some lows you can use for tank since that one was built making sure that it could keep up with the fastest cynabals possible (aka all ODs in lows) indefinitely, so it needed cap recharge and extra speed mods to prove that, but you should usually not need more then 1 OD in order to keep up, especially if you fit neuts in the highs. 2 small neuts added on top of already running an ECM burst and a MWD will cap the cynabal out in 30 seconds. neut. drones. I'v been tackled by these before and without ECM support or a ton of crap landing fairly fast you either shake tackle because he got too cautions, got too close to get neuted or again back in AC range/had to disengage from drones. Reward small gang/solo pvp!
Morel Nova Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.04.14 12:47:00 - [12] Originally by: Darthewok in addition, i see lots of multiple dramiel/cynabal teams around. they are far far more dangerous than the inty/vaga teams that previously were around as they have much more DPS to kill more stuff quicker and much more GTFO ability. basically the OPness of the individual ships are compounded in groups and in combination. not sure what you mean. they have more GTFO:ness, but for gangs they will be less efficient with scimitar support due to worse resists. in the general fits cynabals have less dps than vagabonds though (but not much) Reward small gang/solo pvp!
Morel Nova Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.04.14 15:51:00 - [13] Edited by: Morel Nova on 14/04/2010 15:51:39 Originally by: Jarne If it hasn't been mentioned yet, use a LG Jackal set. Cheap as hell and gives an extra 7 points sensor strength flat. interesting, didnt think about that because I thought they were easily 300+ mil. no market access atm, how much are they? Reward small gang/solo pvp!
Morel Nova Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.04.15 09:46:00 - [14] Originally by: Darthewok Originally by: Cpt Branko Edited by: Cpt Branko on 15/04/2010 01:28:47 Edited by: Cpt Branko on 15/04/2010 01:28:02 Originally by: Darthewok A Vaga that you cannot chase off due to higher gank/tank, that you cannot even catch if it is careless (because of dual prop/ECM burst)? Idk, I had one engage me the first time (ehp fit) and instead of doing the usual Vagabond trick (exploding) he got away in half hull Damn faction ships and their armor/hull HP. Definitely a lot sturdier ship when EHP fitted then a Vagabond, but it can't do all the things you say at the same time, you know? It's either got more EHP (except vs lasers) or has ecm burst or has dual prop (or sensor booster to combine with wcs, lol), can't do all three at the same time obviously. ok, it can't do all 3 at once i suppose but to do just 1 or 2 of the 3 already raises its survival rate ridiculously i understand people enjoying hum-drumiel/cy-no-balls for a while and benefiting from them but this is getting old so what do you propose it should get instead for the extra 120 mil or so you have to sink into the ship? cynabals were massively unbalanced at 120 mil price. now that they are 220+ or so its fine. they are just still so common due to people having bought a ton when they were cheap due to that accidental BPO drop fiasco. I'm not buying any more for a while, because I can get "pretty close" to the performance on a vagabond at less than half price. Reward small gang/solo pvp!
Morel Nova Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.04.15 14:33:00 - [15] Originally by: Jekyl Eraser Those speedy ships are the only ships you can solo in and have a chance vs the blobs. Wish there were more of them. Dramiel is a bit too much but cynabal is just too much like vagabond++. It needs some stat(s) weaker than vaga...like 5% less speed or 15% less cap. In the end i think supply and demand take care of the price difference and cynabal will have 2x or bigger price tag over vagabond. pretty much this. they should have a ship per race capable of this tbh. make sacrilige nanoable again, make deimos very speedy/agile perhaps, caldari has navy caracal so they are pretty fine. Reward small gang/solo pvp!

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